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HOW TO TALK TO
MARKETING
PEOPLE
HOW TO TALK
TO MARKETING PEOPLE
rui.carmo@co.sapo.pt
@rcarmo onTwitter
I HAVE A CONFESSION
TO MAKE
I USEDTO BE ONE OF THEM
BUT I SAWTHE LIGHT
SO WHY ARE WE HERE
TODAY?
THE ETERNAL STRUGGLE
• Throughout the ages,
technical and Marketing
people have been at odds
with one another
• Some say it goes back a
long, long way, to the
beginning ofTime itself...
ENGINEER MARKETEER
DRESS CODE
HOW WE LOOKTO
THEM
HOWTHEY LOOKTO
US
BUT ARETHEY EVEN
HUMAN?
• They’re just, huh... Different
• They have different goals,
priorities and ideas
• For instance, they honestly
believe stuff like this works
to sell products
BUT IS IT REALLY A
CONFLICT?
• Some say it is worse than
trench warfare
• Others deny ever being
involved
• Most just wish Marketing
was outsourced to India
instead
INTHE END, IT’S
JUST A MATTER
OF BALANCE
They’re just people like
you and me
BUT CAN WE EVEN
COMMUNICATE?
• Yes!
• But we approach things from different
angles
• Marketing wants features, and
doesn’t know how much it takes to
implement them
• Engineering wants robustness and
common sense
BUTTHEY
WANT USTO
DO THIS!
Yeah, I know it’s impossible.
It usually is.
IT’S ALL ABOUT
PERSPECTIVE
You say: They want to hear:
FAST NOW
GOOD PRETTY
CHEAP PROFITABLE
ANDTHEY WANT ALL THREE
ANDYOU KNOW WHAT?
INTHE END,
IT’S
OUR FAULT
Because only geeks would
create a t-shirt like this
GEEKS CAN’T INTERACT
WITH NORMAL PEOPLE
• Geeks think of meetings as a
waste of time
• And they’re mostly right
• But that’s largely because
they don’t parse non-
verbal communication
• Normal people use
meetings not as a way to
decide things, but as a way
to reassure themselves
they’re doing the right thing
• And to make sure everyone
is in sync
SO IFTHINGS
GO
WRONG...
It’s our fault for not taking the
time and patience to explain
BUT EVEN WHEN WE DO EXPLAIN...
WE GO IN
TOO HARD
There’s no need to treat
people like idiots
OR WE GO IN
TOO DEEP
There’s really no need to
discuss things at the bit level
GEEKS CAN’T LIE
SINCE WE CAN’T LIE,WE
ALWAYS SAY TOO MUCH
• We deluge people in too much
detail
• We make a point of showing off
what we know
• And what they don’t
• We treat meetings as a waste
of time and group
therapy
• And we often let them know
too much about what we think
• Because we’re tactless
• So we end up losing their
respect
• And, ultimately, their trust
• So no wonder they think techies
are hot-swappable
WE DON’T ABSTRACT
IMPLEMENTATION DETAILS
• To Marketing, you needing
Python 3000 is a detail
• To you, it’s a religious issue
• To Marketing, IE is just a
browser
• Okay, they have that one
wrong...
• To Marketing, how you get
things done doesn’t matter
• It only matters that it’s
done on time
• To you, it’s almost the only
thing that matters
ANDTHIS IS WHAT WE
SOUND LIKE
• “Yes, we can do that, but we
need to rebuild the
frobiscle and compile it
with the goosnargh so we
can do it in sequel.”
• “No way the scrabel is
going to work with our
partner’s ancient vorsiple
backbone.”
BECAUSE WE
DON’T READ
EXPRESSIONS
...or even bother to figure out
if people want to hear that
SO HOW DO WE ACTUALLY
TALKTOTHEM?
THE ANSWER MAY
SURPRISEYOU...
BY LISTENING
SURE, IT HELPS
WHENTHEY’RE
CUTE
...and smart.
And I mean real smart...
BUT WHAT ARETHEY
ACTUALLY SAYING?
Customer Penetration It’s not about sex
Customer Retention Stop scaring the customers away
Campaigns We need to put some ads up
Billing
We all need to
make money here
Focus Group
Someone else that hasn’t
seen this stuff, ever
Churn The ones we already scared off
YES,THEYTOO HAVE
JARGON, BUT IT’S EASIER
Commissioning
What we award the people
who actually make the sale
Segmentation
We want all customers
with shoe size 38
User Generated Content
We don’t want to
pay for content
Feature Parity
What we need you to steal
from the competition
Differentiation What they’ll steal from us next
Social Media
That new stuff we
haven’t figured out yet
OF COURSE,WE ALSO NEEDTO
KNOW HOWTO TALK BACK
...POLITELY
OR ELSE...
BUT WE CAN STILL FIX THINGS
THANK YOU
QUESTIONS?
I FINDYOUR LACK OF
QUESTIONS DISTURBING

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How to talk to marketing people

  • 1. HOW TO TALK TO MARKETING PEOPLE
  • 2. HOW TO TALK TO MARKETING PEOPLE rui.carmo@co.sapo.pt @rcarmo onTwitter
  • 3. I HAVE A CONFESSION TO MAKE
  • 4. I USEDTO BE ONE OF THEM
  • 5. BUT I SAWTHE LIGHT
  • 6. SO WHY ARE WE HERE TODAY?
  • 7. THE ETERNAL STRUGGLE • Throughout the ages, technical and Marketing people have been at odds with one another • Some say it goes back a long, long way, to the beginning ofTime itself...
  • 9. DRESS CODE HOW WE LOOKTO THEM HOWTHEY LOOKTO US
  • 10. BUT ARETHEY EVEN HUMAN? • They’re just, huh... Different • They have different goals, priorities and ideas • For instance, they honestly believe stuff like this works to sell products
  • 11. BUT IS IT REALLY A CONFLICT? • Some say it is worse than trench warfare • Others deny ever being involved • Most just wish Marketing was outsourced to India instead
  • 12. INTHE END, IT’S JUST A MATTER OF BALANCE They’re just people like you and me
  • 13. BUT CAN WE EVEN COMMUNICATE? • Yes! • But we approach things from different angles • Marketing wants features, and doesn’t know how much it takes to implement them • Engineering wants robustness and common sense
  • 14. BUTTHEY WANT USTO DO THIS! Yeah, I know it’s impossible. It usually is.
  • 15. IT’S ALL ABOUT PERSPECTIVE You say: They want to hear: FAST NOW GOOD PRETTY CHEAP PROFITABLE ANDTHEY WANT ALL THREE
  • 17. INTHE END, IT’S OUR FAULT Because only geeks would create a t-shirt like this
  • 18. GEEKS CAN’T INTERACT WITH NORMAL PEOPLE • Geeks think of meetings as a waste of time • And they’re mostly right • But that’s largely because they don’t parse non- verbal communication • Normal people use meetings not as a way to decide things, but as a way to reassure themselves they’re doing the right thing • And to make sure everyone is in sync
  • 19. SO IFTHINGS GO WRONG... It’s our fault for not taking the time and patience to explain
  • 20. BUT EVEN WHEN WE DO EXPLAIN...
  • 21. WE GO IN TOO HARD There’s no need to treat people like idiots
  • 22. OR WE GO IN TOO DEEP There’s really no need to discuss things at the bit level
  • 24. SINCE WE CAN’T LIE,WE ALWAYS SAY TOO MUCH • We deluge people in too much detail • We make a point of showing off what we know • And what they don’t • We treat meetings as a waste of time and group therapy • And we often let them know too much about what we think • Because we’re tactless • So we end up losing their respect • And, ultimately, their trust • So no wonder they think techies are hot-swappable
  • 25. WE DON’T ABSTRACT IMPLEMENTATION DETAILS • To Marketing, you needing Python 3000 is a detail • To you, it’s a religious issue • To Marketing, IE is just a browser • Okay, they have that one wrong... • To Marketing, how you get things done doesn’t matter • It only matters that it’s done on time • To you, it’s almost the only thing that matters
  • 26. ANDTHIS IS WHAT WE SOUND LIKE • “Yes, we can do that, but we need to rebuild the frobiscle and compile it with the goosnargh so we can do it in sequel.” • “No way the scrabel is going to work with our partner’s ancient vorsiple backbone.”
  • 27. BECAUSE WE DON’T READ EXPRESSIONS ...or even bother to figure out if people want to hear that
  • 28. SO HOW DO WE ACTUALLY TALKTOTHEM?
  • 31. SURE, IT HELPS WHENTHEY’RE CUTE ...and smart. And I mean real smart...
  • 32. BUT WHAT ARETHEY ACTUALLY SAYING? Customer Penetration It’s not about sex Customer Retention Stop scaring the customers away Campaigns We need to put some ads up Billing We all need to make money here Focus Group Someone else that hasn’t seen this stuff, ever Churn The ones we already scared off
  • 33. YES,THEYTOO HAVE JARGON, BUT IT’S EASIER Commissioning What we award the people who actually make the sale Segmentation We want all customers with shoe size 38 User Generated Content We don’t want to pay for content Feature Parity What we need you to steal from the competition Differentiation What they’ll steal from us next Social Media That new stuff we haven’t figured out yet
  • 34. OF COURSE,WE ALSO NEEDTO KNOW HOWTO TALK BACK ...POLITELY
  • 36. BUT WE CAN STILL FIX THINGS
  • 39. I FINDYOUR LACK OF QUESTIONS DISTURBING